12th June 2014, 08:49 PM
My advice to all, for the duration of this thread, is put him on ignore, don't rise to any of his patronising quips or whatever other Mittyesque bluster he comes out with, the sad fact for him he rigs one brand of sail and thus doesn't, like the rest of us that might switch between brand from time to time whilst retaining one mast, necessarily come up against the problems we have and he is, as he has so often reminded us, a complete 'expert' at anything we may choose to discuss.
Personally on small rigs I've gotten away with Boxers, Manics and XO sharks rigged on the same Ezzy mast with a bit of tweaking and tuning, even though now and again you have to slide a sail up or down a bit because the smaller ones have an adjustable head, which is another prime opportunity to rig things wrong, just having the sail at the wrong part of the curve can make a sail look knaff.
So again don't get put off by 'him' or anyone else for that matter, let this thread run for a bit, now and again post a pic and lets see the problem or share an issue you've had and cured.
As to mast bends and curves, the way to check is bend the mast with a line, bow and arrow style.
If you have more than one mast you'll soon see any difference.
12th June 2014, 08:54 PM
Excuse me for being nervous about threads like these - the last one we had was basically trying to say how RDM masts were rubbish and they sink.
The reality is that most people trying RDMs wouldn't now use anything else.
Then we had that thread where people were claiming batten tensioners on rotational sails as sail power tuning devices.
12th June 2014, 08:56 PM
Quite right, and a nice about turn from
Originally Posted by basher
If ever we needed an example that the "crap" we have to "watch out for" comes mostly from you, here it is.
Originally Posted by basher
12th June 2014, 09:00 PM
Rod, bung him on ignore, your input is valuable, his isn't we don't need it, there are plenty of level heads here that can help Sweifish and everyone else who needs it, sort out multi brand rig tuning issues, don't rise to him, eventually he'll get fed up and butt out, or we get a moderator to have a word with him.
12th June 2014, 10:31 PM
So, what's more important? that a sail looks good/ right, or it sails/ feels right.
13th June 2014, 12:43 AM
I stick with my statement that you can use a sail on the mast you already have and it may work acceptably. I wasn't advocating deliberately using the wrong mast.
The advice was to try this to see – use different settings before splashing the cash on a new mast. Rigging is not a science where you are a slave to numbers printed on sail bags – it's more an art to learn and to go off road with.
And that's how most people live, in the real world. Your 5m or 8m sail wears out so you buy a new one. Maybe you go for exactly the same sail, or you go for one on offer in your local shop or one found cheap second hand.
And then you set it on the mast you already have.
(It wasn't all that many decades ago that sailors were stuck rigging all size sails on their one 460 Rotho wave, haha.
And it's still true that if you need to be on the 'right' sail for that day, then sail size – sail area – comes before perfect performance.)
But rigs are so much better now, and a lot of windsurfers ARE skilled enough to know when a rig is working well and feels good in the hands. And to get the best performance from a modern sail it's best to set it on the recommended mast or on one which has similar bend characteristics.
With the 'wrong' mast, you get a sail that is sensitive to downhaul and outhaul settings – and you find you are forever tweaking these setting to get a stable feel.
With the 'best' mast, a sail should have a whole range of acceptable settings, and the rig will deal with wind strength variation on its own, without much fiddling.
We are all different weights however, using the same sail in different wind strengths, and what works for one sailor may not be the same for another. So please break free from taking a hard line on what rig settings you must use.
So I would answer Paddy360's question – it's more important to get a sail that works and feels right before buying one on looks nice.
But if you do buy one on looks, then try it on the mast you have first and see how acceptable the performance is. If there is no wind range for the rig – or if the sail just won't set well at all – then you'll need to buy a mast to fit.
Back on topic,
This thread is about creases. Do many sails get bad creases nowadays?
Last edited by basher; 13th June 2014 at 12:59 AM.
13th June 2014, 01:45 PM
Admittedly, I haven't rigged sails as many times as most on this forum.
I found David Ezzy's rigging instruction videos very helpful but de-rigging seems to be where my sails got creased (even when the mast was twisted while it was withdrawn from the Luff sleeve). I solved this problem by asking someone to stand on the mast cup or (if I am alone, I attach a simple strap and hook that I have made to a tree or railing and attach this to the cup strap. Works well for me....